Where are the Omnivores?

Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 9:58 am

Moloth wrote:

nogods wrote:

Is any animal's sole purpose to be food stuff?

please define us the other purposes for krill. Life is about reproduction. To reproduce, one must consume matter and energy. the best place to gain matter and energy is from other living organisms... be they plant or animal.

For the Krill, their purpose is not to be food, of that we can be sure. That is why they try to escape predators, not offer themselves too predators.

They have their own life, they like us struggle to survive. They have nerves, a brain, eyes, a mouth. I would ask why destroy it for food, when it is not necessary for us to do so?

I would ask what moral reasons are they to kill it?

Now, I willingly admit, I care less about the killing of krill, then I do say pigs? But, since neither is necessary, why do either?

Other living things, are not the best place for us human beings to get energy and matter, they are the only place. So yes, we need to consume energy, but since you and I are in a position where we can consume energy from non-sentient sources, why destroy sentient ones?

Why not allow them their moment of life upon this earth, just as we hope to be allowed ours. There life has enough cruelty, without us unnecessarily adding to that cruelty.

nogods wrote:

If we see animals merely as foodstuuf, is this not to deny them of any being, of any relation with us in the evolutionary web of life. That they too have nerves and brains; blood and bone. That they too seek safety; food; shelter; etc. They are living beings - no matter how small their capacity for happiness may be surely it is not something to be taken lightly, not soemthing to be withdrawn wantonly or caprisciously.

When kindness to animals costs us so little, are we more or less of a person when we withhold it?

Moloth wrote:

we are not denying their place in the web of life... we are affirming it. tell me.. the strands that make up the web.. what do they signify? what do the arrows MEAN?

The arrows on your food chart say nothing about ethics.

By sharing a place on the web of life I mean they have evolved brains, nerves, sense organs etc., for the same reasons we have. What point would a nerve be if it could not feel pain? Recognising that sentient beings can experience pain, stress, suffering etc, things that we seek to avoid for ourselves, is what I mean by recognising non-human animals relationship with us on the evolutionary web of life.

The nerves in your body evolved in the body of non-human animals long before humans ever came on the scene. The brain in your head began its evolvolution in non-human animals long before human beings came on the scene.

To say, my nerves are to feel pain, and my instinct is to avoid pain, but that the nerves in a pig do not feel pain, and its instinct is not to avoid it, is to deny the evolutionary path our own DNA has taken over the milleniums.

If the pig feels pain, stress, fear etc., then why should we inflict them upon it, if it is not necesarry. Why not ofer them the same mercy you want others to show to yourself.

nogods

Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 10:26 am

SkepDick wrote:

Ahhh, I get it now. I guess it could be taken either way.

Well it could if I included the word "or"

It should really have read

"You know nothing about me, or Richard, nor I suspect, the vast majority of vegans in the USA or UK."

I should spend more time proofing my postings, but rarely have the time, finding time to write to the forum can prove difficult enough.

You know how it is with us vegans, having to eat food three of four times a day, means we have little time for other things. Oh, how I remember my omnivore days, when I could gladly starve myself for months on end, and still find time for apathy;-)

(Sorry Moloth, couldn't resist having a bit of fun).

nogods

Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 2:03 pm

lol... no worries.

My problem is, for the purposes of this discussion, that i am not as nearly die-hard or pro-meat eating as you are pro-vegan.

In the end... at the very end of the day and at the final conclusion to the question at hand, i agree with you on the basic premise of morality: suffering = bad.

to defend that point, even at the expense of starving a baleen whale its single meal of millions of krill, makes one out to be nothing short of evil .

If each life is sacred, why not measure on the number ? i have, personally, in some way, caused the death of dozens/hundreds of cows over the course of my life. If all lifeforms are to be equally sacred, why not create a tofu replacement for the millions of plankton and krill that are devoured, with gusto, each and every hour across the oceans?

If we are to treat all lifeforms as we wish to be treated, from whence comes anti-bacterial soap? penicillin has caused the death of trillions of perfectly fine, happily reproducing, lives over the last century...

((surely, by this point, you all must have realized that i am merely going through the motions on this topic...))

Just Arrived Joined: Oct 26, 2005 Posts: 8

Moloth wrote:

((surely, by this point, you all must have realized that i am merely going through the motions on this topic...))

If that is the case, then how about you try answering your own questions. I've got answers for them but I'd like to see what you come up with.

Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 1:03 pm

Well, i've gone much more towards vegetarian since this show.

It just makes sense.. the way you eat really affects the way you feel. And i've been feeling much better since dropping soda/caffeine and a big one for me was milk.

For me, in my location, its just as easy to cook vegetarian as it is omnivore....

And Richard, thanks for the insight, I'll never be vegan, I still love my occasional t-bone, lol... but i'd say 95% of my diet is now vegetarian. And I feel fucking great.

Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 2:23 pm

I can't wait until we get a tree that grows oranges that are full of beef instead of fruit. Where's my meat tree?!?!


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